should demigods be worshiped ? [Archive]

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20-02-06, 09:42 PM

Should we worship demigods like God Shiva, Maa Kaali, Maa Durga, Hanuman Ji, Lord Rama along with lord krishna OR worshiping only Lord Krishna is enough, what krishna instructs about it ?.

22-02-06, 02:51 AM

Should we worship demigods like God Shiva, Maa Kaali, Maa Durga, Hanuman Ji, Lord Rama along with lord krishna OR worshiping only Lord Krishna is enough, what krishna instructs about it ?.

Bhagavad-gita very clearly explains this. We are to respect the demigods not worship them. Lord Krishna is the Supreme Lord and by worshiping Lord Krishna we satisfy everyone.

BTW, Lord Rama is not a demigod.

suekeno2005

22-02-06, 06:45 PM

Hare Krishna!

OK, I am sort of new to all of this, and I don't know everything, but this was a question of mine too, so I sought the answer.

Yes, there are demigods sent by Lord Krishna to rule over different aspects of the material world. But if you pray to them you will only gain that particular aspect of the material world, and that is what a devotee is trying to avoid, material attatchments.

But if you give praise to Krishna the praise will trickle down to the demigods, and this is the correct way to do it. All praises should be given to Lord Krishna as he is the source of all things.

You would not water just the leaves of a tree, but if you water the tree at the roots, the whole tree will benefit.

A link: http://krishna.krishna.org/Articles/2004/12/025.html

I hope I have expressed this correctly, please feel free to add or comment if I have misunderstood.

your servant,

Sue

22-02-06, 07:58 PM

Yes, this discussion went on at this link:

http://s14.invisionfree.com/Radha_Damodara_Forum/index.php?showtopic=69

with loads of verse references and quotes to help.

suekeno2005

23-02-06, 05:17 PM

Thank you Rukmini Devi Dasi for posting that link.

You are correct, you did post a lot of helpful material there and I do suggest anyone who is curious like I was to read it. It was so helpful to me.

Hare Krishna,

Sue

24-02-06, 01:54 AM

You would not water just the leaves of a tree, but if you water the tree at the roots, the whole tree will benefit.

Thanks ! that quote is wonderful. Thanks Rukmini and Sue. I did read the earlier what Lord Krishna said in The Bhagwat Gita, but just wanted to confirm, as I have not read The Bhagwat Gita fully yet :(

As you said Lord Rama is not a demigod and you have not spoken about lord Shiva ( i trust he is also not a demigod ). can you please give more details about Lord Shiva and Lord Rama and how they are connected with Lord Krishna OR are they all one ? .. I am learning

Thanks

24-02-06, 02:18 AM

Thanks ! that quote is wonderful. Thanks Rukmini and Sue. I did read the earlier what Lord Krishna said in The Bhagwat Gita, but just wanted to confirm, as I have not read The Bhagwat Gita fully yet :(

As you said Lord Rama is not a demigod and you have not spoken about lord Shiva ( i trust he is also not a demigod ). can you please give more details about Lord Shiva and Lord Rama and how they are connected with Lord Krishna OR are they all one ? .. I am learning
Thanks

:D Srila Prabhupada explains very nicely for us in Bhagavad-gita As It Is all about the demigod, Lord Krishna and much more!

Lord Rama is a plenary incarnation of Lord Krishna.

Here is a talk between Srila Prabhupada and a disciple that will help to explain who Lord Siva is:

Class by A.C.Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupad
Bhagavad-gita 2.27-38

Los Angeles, December 11, 1968

Q & A

Madhudvisa: Prabhupada? What is the position of Lord Siva?

Prabhupada: Lord Siva is a demigod, but he is higher than all other demigods. He's higher than Lord Brahma also. But he's not the Supreme Lord. Just like there are different gradations. That is not difficult to understand. In society also, there are different gradations. Similarly, the living entities, there are different gradations. So all the living entities, they are, some of them are situated in higher planets, some of them are situated in lower planets, some of them are situated in high-grade life, in low-grade life. So the demigods are also, they are living entities, but they are enjoying better standard of life due to their acts of piety. But Lord Siva is not amongst the living entities. He's above the living entities but he is counted as one of the demigods. But his position is better th! an Lord Brahma even. Brahma is to be the highest iving entity within the universe, and Lord Siva's position is higher than Lord Brahma.

Madhudvisa: Does Lord Siva have a wife, like, a consort?

Prabhupada: Yes. Parvati. Sati. Everyone has got wife. Yes. Sakti.

Devotee: Is Lord Siva a devotee of Lord Krishna?

Prabhupada: Yes. Everyone is devotee. Only the madmen, they are not devotees. Any sane man is devotee of... Sanity means become devotee. That is sanity. And one who is not devotee is insane, insanity. So how you can expect that Lord Siva is not devotee? He's not insane. We are, the material, the ordinary living entities, in the lower grades of life, they are all insane.

24-02-06, 02:31 AM

Thank you..

a) What about Lord Rama ?

b) If Lord Shiva is a demigod then why Lord Krishna worships him ?
In fact why they worship each-other ?

Looking forward to more great answers.

cherry

24-02-06, 12:22 PM

Lord Siva is very special, read above Rukmini's comment. He is more than a demigod, he is often said to be the greatest vaisnava. Below is all taken from Caitanya Bhagavata.

'Caitanya Bhagavata' by Vrndavana dasa Thakura (Antya Lila - chapter 4)

'Lord Krsna Himself says that how can any person worship Him and not worship Siva?.
How can one develop love for Krsna if he disregards Lord Siva who is so dear to Lord Krsna.
In the Srimad Bhagavatam it says "How can anyone render devotional service to Me without
worshipping My dear devotee Siva in the proper devotional mood. A person who does not
respect Siva is envious of the Vaisnavas and is a sinful reprobate."
Again, in the Skanda Purana it says "First one should worship Lord Krsna, the cause of all
causes, and then worship the best of the demigods, Lord Siva. Then all the other demigods
should be worshiped with great faith and devotion."
Sri Advaita Arcarya is accepted by the saintly personalities as Siva himself. This is so
because Lord Caitanya gave sufficient indications to establish this truth.'

bhakta

28-02-06, 09:02 PM

can you please give more details about Lord Shiva and Lord Rama and how they are connected with Lord Krishna OR are they all one ? .. I am learning

Hari Bol

A text on shiva tatwa:
The glories of Harihara,
http://www.sribabaji.org/portal/filemgmt/index.php

Damodar

28-02-06, 11:13 PM

Cherry, thank you for your nice message!

He is more than a demigod

Actually, this isn't precisely correct. Lord Siva is a very special demigod, but a demigod, nonetheless - ultimately nothing more, nothing less. :wink:

Caitanya Bhagavata' by Vrndavana dasa Thakura (Antya Lila - chapter 4) ...

My I enquire as to who did this particular translation you are copying from? Thanks! :)

In the Srimad Bhagavatam it says ...

Would you please do me a favor, and give the Canto, chapter and verse for that quote? I find it a very interesting verse, and would like to study it. I'd very much appreciate it! :)

Your Servant,
Damodara dasa

cherry

01-03-06, 10:29 AM

Damodar!! :) i accept your challenge (!) to show the glories of Lord Siva, but then i will have to kill you, lol just kidding, wait on, i'll try again :)
Damodar!! :) i accept your challenge (!) to show the glories of Lord Siva, but i need a week he he :)
yes, i'll answer the questions you asked, but then you must tell me if you think Lord Siva is still 'a very special demigod, but a demigod, nonetheless -ultimately nothing more, nothing less'

Pankaja dasa

01-03-06, 05:46 PM

Bhakta Prabhuji that site you gave is simply bogus.! :oops:

Ps. Shiva-tattva is complex. :cry:

I think you need to be highly advanced to understand him, I was
reading the site you posted in the links section, this is one quote from it which I though best described me at the moment. Haribol.

'anarthas and aparadhas cover the soul's sraddha' :roll:

Damodar

01-03-06, 07:17 PM

bhakta

02-03-06, 10:00 AM

Pankaja dasa

02-03-06, 01:09 PM

The site propagates some philosophy of oneness. ANyway My tiny brain doesn't want to bother :P my mind with it.

Erm so many bogus philosophies to get rid of and so little time. :shock:

bhakta

02-03-06, 05:05 PM

The site propagates some philosophy of oneness. ANyway My tiny brain doesn't want to bother :P my mind with it.

Erm so many bogus philosophies to get rid of and so little time. :shock:

hari bol
gaura nitai

:)

the site is what it is, bogus or not - the text I am referring to quotes our vaisnava masters, so...

:)

03-03-06, 10:58 PM

In the Srimad Bhagavatam it says "How can anyone render devotional service to Me without worshipping My dear devotee Siva in the proper devotional mood. A person who does not
respect Siva is envious of the Vaisnavas and is a sinful reprobate."

Cherry,

I have done a search thru the folio disk for this verse in Srimad Bhagavatam but I keep coming up with nothing.

I like to read surrounding text and Prabhupada's purports so could you please post the Canto, Chapter and verse number so I can find it?

thanks
Rukmini-Devi dasi

cherry

05-03-06, 03:16 PM

ahhhhh haaaaa i'm back, ya miss me?! :))
thank you for you patience, except you Rukmini he he :)
ok, this is interesting. first off, that post i made, quoting Vrndavana dasa Thakura, the whole 10 lines come from his Caitanya Bhagavata, nothing is my words, so i don't know why you are asking me to quote the place in SB, it is Vrndavana dasa Thakura that has not written exact place, not me.
Nevertheless, i have some light to shed on this, as you will see below.
i asked for a week, because, Damodar, when you asked me to say which Caitanya Bhagavata i have, to my horror i realised that i have, even though an iskcon release, it is a 'pre-release' copy, and has no info whatsoever on who translated or anything lol, so fearing if i said this, you great souls would take up your bows, and placing an arrow charged with mystic power, take aim at me, i went to work on saving myself :)
so, i emailed Pundarika V das, who has a major translation of the book, and his reply is interesting. i will post it below.
also, 2 Caitanya Bhagavata's online, i will give the links, both will verify what i quoted is indeed true.
also, just today, i bought a copy translated by Sarvabhavana dasa, which gives the verses i quoted 'exactly', so it seems my 'pre-release' copy is from him, which Pundarika dasa also thought my copy was his.
btw, Rukmini, Pundarika dasa, as you can read below, is of the opinion that the verse which is said to be from SB is actually from the Padma Purana, so this is why you couldn't find. Still, it has been spoken by Vyasa, coming from Lord Krsna.
Finally, i will give some info coming from a book by Mahanidhi Swami, called 'Appreciating Vrndavana Dhama' which is full of quotes from Vaisnava books, about Lord Siva, that leaves no doubt about his greatness. Some of these quotes come from Srila Prabhupada, from the SB, verses and purports. Nothing below then, is coming from my mouth, please let this be clear. The only thing i have myself written, is in brackets, and only indicting things to check out from SB, Prabhupada's purports, which strongly leave no doubt about the glories of Lord Siva.
Also, please note the parts at the end, to do with Sanatana Gosvami and Raghunatha Gosvami, which are interesting.
sorry for length, i hate long posts, but it is not me speaking, so it is nectar and i hope you enjoy. i will post it all in a second thread, which i will do straight away. oh, i might give links to online Caitanya Bhagavata's here.
main page
http://www.geocities.com/caitanyamahaprabhu/bhagavat.htm
chapter 4 (it is 7th last and 6th last main paragraphs)
http://www.geocities.com/caitanyamahaprabhu/bhagt4.htm
2nd CB online
http://www.harekrsna.com/philosophy/gss/sastra/literature/texts/vrindaban.htm

cherry

05-03-06, 03:20 PM

email from ....
Thanks for your nice question. Here is our translation of the section you
requested:

çré-vadane kånëacandra bolena äpane
"çiva ye nä püje, se vä more püje kene?
Lord Krsnacandra has declared with His own mouth, "Why would anyone who does
not worship Siva worship Me?
TEXT 481
mora priya çiva-prati anädara yära
ke-mate vä more bhakti haibe tähära"
"How can a person who disrespects My dear Siva attain My devotional
service?"
TEXT 482
kathaà vä mayi bhaktià sa
labhatäà päpa-purunaù
yo madéyaà paraà bhaktaà
çivaà sampüjayenna hi
"How can a sinful person who is envious of the Vaisnavas attain devotional
service if he does not respectfully worship My dear devotee Siva?"
TEXT 483
"ataeva sarvädye çré-kånëa püji' tabe
préte çiva püji' püjibeka sarva-deve"
"Therefore one should first worship Lord Krsna, then after worshiping Lord
Siva with love, he should worship all the demigods."
TEXT 484
In the Skanda Puräëa it is stated:
prathamaà keçavaà püjäà
kåtvä deva maheçvaram
püjanéyä mahäbhaktyä
ye cänye santi devatäù
"First one should worship Çré Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead and
cause of all causes, then one should worship Maheçvara, the best of the
demigods, thereafter one should worship all the demigods with full devotion.
TEXT 485
hena `çiva' advaitere bale sädhu-jane
seha çré-caitanyacandra-iìgita-käraëe
Because of Lord Caitanya's indication, Advaita is accepted by saintly
persons as that Siva.

END OF SECTION

The verse quoted in 482 is from the Padma Purana, Nirvana-khanda, not the
Srimad Bhagavatam.

The verse (482) in the version you quoted from was translated by
Sarvabhavana Prabhu. "How can anyone render devotional service to Me (Lord Krsna) without
worshiping My dear devotee Siva in the proper devotional mood. A person who
does not respect Siva is envious of the Vaisnavas and is a sinful
reprobate."

Thanks for bringing this to my notice. And I hope you will not mind if I
comment that while we certainly should offer all respect Siva as the topmost
Vaisnava, he would surely be pleased by our adherence to the system of
worship established by Srila Prabhupada, who wrote in his purport to the
Caitanya-caritamrta, Adi-lila, Chapter 14, text 50:

"Our position of not allowing worship of the many hundreds of demigods was
confirmed by Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu even in His childhood. Srila Narottama
dasa Thakura has sung in this connection:
anya devasraya nai tomare kahinu bhai
ei bhakti parama-karana
“To become a staunch, pure devotee of the Supreme Personality of Godhead
without deviation [ananya-bhak], one should not divert his attention to the
worship of the demigods. Such control is a symptom of pure devotional
service.”

Hope this meets you well.
your servant
Pundarika V das :)
========================

Appreciating Sri Vrndavana Dhama - Mahanidhi Swami (quotes from many Vaisnava books)
(please note all below comes from this book, nothing from me, most have references)

"All glories, all glories to Gopisvara Siva, who resides in Vrndavana in order to protect
the holy dhama" (Songs of the Vaisnava Acaryas).

In Sri Vrndavana, Lord Siva, as the protecting deity, serves Radha and Krsna by guarding
most of Their confidential pastime abodes such as the rasa-lila grounds at Vamsivata, and
the favorite bathing ponds of the Divine Couple, Sri Shyama-kunda and Radha-kunda.
Sri Krsna's great-grandson, Vajranabha, established many Siva-lingas in Vrndavana:
Cakalesvara at Manasi Ganga; Nandisvara at Nandagrama; Kamesvara at Kamyavana; Gopisvara
at Vamsivata.

The Appearance of Gopisvara
Once Lord Siva desired to participate in Sri Krsna's exclusive rasa dance, but being male
he was denied entrance. Following Lalita-sakhi's suggestion, Lord Siva bathed in
Mana-sarovara, became a gopi and joined the rasa dance. Pleased with this new gopi's
service, Sri Krsna gave the name "Gopisvara". Krsna then requested Siva to protect the
gopis by guarding the rasa dance entrance. Lord Siva's duty was to prohibit anyone with
the purusa abhiman (enjoying spirit) from entering the rasa dance. By the grace of
Gopisvara Siva a devotee can become free from the enjoying spirit, and receive the darsan
of Lord Krsna's divine rasa dance.

The Glories of Mahadeva
"Lord Siva teaches the sincere devotee of the Lord how to practice detachment from material
enjoyment. Siva is very great, and his renunciation of all material enjoyment is an ideal
example of how one should be materially unattached. One should therefore follow in his
footsteps and be unattached to matter. Siva is called Mahadeva, or the greatest of all
demigods, and no one is equal to or greater than him in the material world" (SB 3.14.26-29p)
(READ PRABHUPADA'S VERSE'S AND PURPORTS SB 3.14. 26, 27, 28, 29).
(PRABHUPADA'S PURPORT 3.14.26 *******)
"Lord Siva, the spiritual master of the entire world, is free from enmity, a peaceful
personality and always satisfied in himself" (SB 4.2.2v).
(READ PRABHUPADA'S PURPORT - SB 4.2.2) (*******)

Lord Shambu (Siva) is constantly mediating upon Lord Sankarsana and chanting Hare Rama,
Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare. While visiting Mt. Kailasa, Narada Muni once praised Lord
Siva: "You desire only the satisfaction of Lord Krsna. You eloquently pray only to remain a
pure devotee of Lord Krsna. What more can I say? You are very dear to Lord Krsna, and by
receiving your mercy many others have also become dear to Krsna" (Brhad-Bhagavatamrta,
Srila Sanatana Gosvami)

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and Lord Siva
Hearing about Lord Caitanya's behavior toward Lord Siva will clarify the relationship.
Wherever Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu traveled, He would visit the prominent Siva temples.
While residing in Varanasi, Lord Caitanya regularly visited the temples of Visvesvara
(Lord Siva).
Srila Vrndavana das Thakur decribes Lord Caitanya's visit to a Siva temple in Orissa.
"Enlivened by His dear devotee's (Siva) opulence and influence in the temple, Lord Caitanya
began to dance happily. Lord Caitanya knows Lord Siva's glorious character, for he is
favorite amongst His devotees. If anyone disrespects Lord Siva, not following the example
of Lord Caitanya, then he cannot be considered a Vaisnava, and all his spiritual advancement
is nullified. (*******)

Honoring Lord Siva
Sri Krsna Himself exalts Lord Siva's position. "Hear Me, oh Siva, you are precious to Me as
My own body. One who is dear to you is even more dear to Me. I allow you to stay in all of My
abodes. In fact, you are the protector and maintainer of all the dhamas. One who claims to be
My devotee, but disregards you is only pretending devotion to me (Skanda Purana). (*******)
Srila Prabhupada offers many illuminating statements regarding the benefits and procedure of
worshiping Lord Siva. "A devotee of Lord Krsna does not disrespect Lord Siva, but worships
Lord Siva as the most exalted devotee of Lord Krsna. Consequently, whenever a devotee
worships Lord Siva, he prays to Lord Siva to achieve the favor of Krsna, and he does not
request material profit" (SB 4.12.30p)
"If anyone sees Lord Siva with devotion and reverence, his heart is immediately cleansed"
(SB 4.7.10p). (*******)

Visiting the Gopisvara Mahadeva Temple
"The gopis also worshiped Lord Siva in Vrndavana, and the lord is still staying there as
Gopisvara. The gopis, however, prayed that Lord Siva bless them by giving them Krsna as their
husband. There is no harm in worshiping demigods, provided one's aim is to return back home,
back to Godhead" (SB. 4.30.38p)
The "Sambandha Acarya" Srila Sanatana Gosvami was closely associated with Lord Siva, and he
took daily darsana of Gopisvara. "Being very close to Lord Siva, Sanatana Gosvami would take
his permission, and always perform his bhajan near a sacred place of Lord Siva; and thereby
feel his protection. At Govardhana Hill, Sanatana Gosvami stayed near the Siva temple at
Cakalesvara; At Kamyavana he remained near Kamesvara Siva and in Vrndavana, Sanatana stayed
at Gopisvara" (Sri Vraja Mandala Parikrama).
"Srila Raghunatha das Gosvami says, 'Desiring to quickly attain the treasure of the embraces
of Sri Krsna, the splendid and affectionate gopis devotedly and happily worshiped Lord Siva
on the bank of the Yamuna. I daily worship Gopisvara-tirtha, where the gopis performed their
worship" (Vraja Vilasstava)

06-03-06, 02:00 AM

first off, that post i made, quoting Vrndavana dasa Thakura, the whole 10 lines come from his Caitanya Bhagavata, nothing is my words, so i don't know why you are asking me to quote the place in SB, it is Vrndavana dasa Thakura that has not written exact place, not me.

Hare Krishna,

Oh, I see now. I misread and thought it was you saying this was the SB verse. That is why I asked where it was.

Thanks for clarifying this for me.

Rukmini-Devi dasi

Pankaja dasa

06-03-06, 08:44 PM

haribol,

I just saw what you quoted.

http://www.download.com/Chaitanya-Bhagavata/3000-2052_4-10500456.html?tag=lst-0-1

CB. Did is long time ago, as e-book with permission.

TOOK ME AGES. I spend more time doing this, then anything I ever did.

suekeno2005

07-03-06, 05:25 PM

Damodar

08-03-06, 07:55 PM

My Dear Cherry,

Thank you for your interesting response to my questions regarding the sources you were citing.

In regards to the idea that Siva is worthy of worship, I am a disciple of Srila Prabhupada, and so much adhere to his numerous & consistant admonitions against worshipping demigods - specifically including, in many instances, Lord Siva.

For the purpose of simplicity - and because all actual and potential devotees of Lord Krishna begin by studying Bhagavad-gita, I will limit my offerings to some of the materials treating this subject to that literature.

Of course, I am referring only to Bhagavad-gita As It Is, and only the MacMillin 1972 edition, as the only one authorized by Srila Prabhupada, himself.

This worshipful edition can be found online at http://www.asitis.com

I am not going to take up huge amounts of space providing lengthy quotes, but rely on every person's ability to read the sections listed, for themselves.

----------

LORD KRISHNA SPEAKS ABOUT WORSHIPPING DEMIGODS: 7.20, 7.21, 7.22, 7.23, 7.24 - Verses & Purports

STRONG STATEMENTS BY SRILA PRABHUPADA ABOUT WORSHIPPING DEMIGODS: 4.13, Purport

WORSHIP IN THE MODE OF GOODNESS IS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE: 17.4 Purport

STATEMENTS REGARDING SIVA AS A DEMIGOD:

2.3 Purport: (Quote: "No living entity, including Brahma, Lord Siva, or Narayana, can possess opulences as fully as Krishna")

2.62 Purport: (states that demigods, including Siva, aresubjected to influence of sense objects)

5.29, Purport: (Krishna is greater than the greatest of demigods, including Siva [Krishna])

7.15, Purport: (Siva, himself, affirms that he cannot give liberation, which is only possible by Visnu)

10.3 Purport: (Krishna is creator of demigods) (read in relation to 7.20-24, especially)

10.7, Purport: (Siva is one of the chief demigods)

** 10.8, Purport: (particularly gives Puranic evidence, especially naming Siva, that states only Krishna is to be worshipped) **

** 10.42 Purport (quote: "Worship of demigods is discouraged herein because even the greatest demigods like Brahma and Siva only represent part of the opulence of the Supreme Lord.")**

----------

I hope reading this nectar will help to clear up any confusion regarding the idea that demigod Siva is to be worshipped.

Hare Krishna,
Damodar

Damodar

08-03-06, 08:05 PM

Hare Krishna!

I found a nice little essay that explains in plain english the importance and correct worship of demigods. Perhaps this will explain it to you.

http://www.krishna.com/main.php?id=107

your servant,

Sue

Hello Sue,

Thank you for giving the link to this interesting discussion regarding demigods.

I would like to highlight the final paragraph of that article, in order to emphasize that disciples of Srila Prabhupada do NOT worship demigods:

QUOTE: "Therefore, the humans are generally advised by all religious traditions to respect these powerful personalities, the demigods, and to please them by being engaged in the service of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Vishnu or Krishna. If one satisfies Krishna, the root of all creation, then all the demigods are also automatically satisfied and supply lavishly all required things to mankind. When the root of a tree is satisfied by water, then the leaves and branches are also satisfied by receiving water from the root. Similarly, when Krishna is satisfied then His parts, the demigods, are also satisfied. Therefore there is no need to worship the demigods. One should worship Krishna alone, and his life will be perfect." (emphasis is mine.)

I hope this finds you well, and happily pursuing Krishna Consciouness!

Your Servant,
Damodar

cherry

09-03-06, 08:19 AM

cherry

09-03-06, 08:27 AM

i am not saying that everyone should worship Lord Siva, i just showed some texts that make it clear that Lord Siva is much more than 'just a demigod'. This is what we were talking about.

Everything below comes from Srila Prabhupada's purports to the Srimad Bhagavatam.

"A devotee of Lord Krsna does not disrespect Lord Siva, but worships
Lord Siva as the most exalted devotee of Lord Krsna. Consequently, whenever a devotee
worships Lord Siva, he prays to Lord Siva to achieve the favor of Krsna, and he does not
request material profit" (SB 4.12.30p)
"If anyone sees Lord Siva with devotion and reverence, his heart is immediately cleansed"
(SB 4.7.10p).

His greatness is incomparable because he is a great devotee of the Supreme Personality
of Godhead. It is said that among all the devotees of the Personality of Godhead, Lord
Siva is the greatest. Thus the remnants of foodstuff left by him are accepted by other
devotees as maha-prasada, or great spiritual foodstuff. The remnants of foodstuff offered
to Lord Krsna are called prasada, but when the same foodstuff is eaten by a great devotee
like Lord Siva, it is called maha-prasada. Lord Siva is so great that he does not care
for the material prosperity for which every one of us is so eager. Parvati, who is the
powerful material nature personified, is under his full control as his wife, yet he does
not use her even to build a residential house. He prefers to remain without shelter, and
his great wife also agrees to live with him humbly. People in general worship goddess
Durga, the wife of Lord Siva, for material prosperity, but Lord Siva engages her in his
service without material desire. He simply advises his great wife that of all kinds of
worship, the worship of Visnu is the highest, and greater than that is the worship of a
great devotee or anything in relation with Visnu. (SB 3.14.26 purport by Srila Prabhupada)

Even Vaisnava's, who are above both the ordinary and the elevated men in this world, also worship Lord Siva as the greatest Vaisnava. Thus he is the friend of everyone - the common men, the elevated men and the devotees of the Lord - so no one should disrespect or create enmity towards Lord Siva. (SB 4.4.15 purport by Srila Prabhupada).

Lord Siva takes charge of reforming persons who are ghosts and demons, not to speak of others, who are godly; therefore he is the spiritual master of everyone, both the dull and demoniac and the highly learned Vaisnavas. It is also stated, vaisnavanam yatha sambhuh: Sambhu, Lord Siva, is the greatest of all Vaisnavas. On one hand he is the worshipable object of the dull demons, and on the other he is the best of all Vaisnavas, or devotees, and he has a sampradaya called the Rudra-sampradaya. (SB 4.2.2 purport by Srila Prabhupada)

cherry

10-03-06, 12:41 AM

Damodar, after you replied with quotes from Bhagavada-gita about not worshiping demigods, i posted a reply in which i just laughed. Since then i have edited it out to just 'ok'.
i don't know if you saw this, but please forgive me for this offence. i have no intelligence and therefore prone to offending people, so i just want to say i am sorry. also, please don't feel you have to respond.
i am also sorry if i offended any other person who might of been offended by seeing my post, and also ask for your forgiveness.

Damodar

10-03-06, 03:30 AM

My Dear Cherry,

Srila Prabhupada teaches us that Lord Krishna considers every living being to be His devotee - even if we do not actually know we are.

I have no enemies - except in my own mind - even tho' some may perceive me to be their enemy ... and this is totally understandable, as we are still residing in this material world, where defending is one of our symptoms-of-behavior.

I hope every moment of every day day is, for you, an adventure in pursuing Lord Krishna, the ultimately attractive Supreme Personality of Godhead!

Your Servant,
Damodara dasa

cherry

10-03-06, 06:28 AM

Damodar, thank you very much for your kind words. Please don't think at any time i ever considered you an enemy.

mathuranath das

25-03-06, 08:24 PM

Dear devotees please accept my dandavat pranams.....

A few thoughts concerning the demigods....Lord Krsna clearly states that wherever we point our consciousness...that is where we will go. In the Gita 9:25, the Lord states:

yanti deva vrata devan
pitrn yanti pitr-vratah
bhtani yanti bhutejya
yanti mad yajino pi-mam

" Those who worship the demigods will take birth amongst the demigods.
Those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth among such beings. Those who worship the ancestors go to the ancestors and those who worship Me, will live with Me."

Its our choice, where we point our attention, and what we attain accordingly.

and also Gita 9:27,

yat koroshi yad asnasi
yaj juhosi dadasi yat
yat tapasyasi kaunteya
tat kausva mad-arpanam

"whatever you do, whatever you eat, whatever you offer or give away, and whatever austerities you perform, do that oh son of Kunti as an offering to Me.'

My Spiritual Master Srila Sridhar Maharaj advised us that if we are attatched to anything other than Lord Krsna, and are unable to reliquish that attatchment we should in the spirit of the above mentioned verse begin to offer it to the Lord, and in no time we will be released from our lower attatchment and attain a higher taste for exclusive devotion...rasa varjam raso py asya param drstva nivartate, Gita 2:59. This yukta vairagya is described in the Bhakti Rasamrta Sindhu of Srila Rupa Goswami 2.253...anasaktasya..Those who are attatched to the idea of recieving temporary benefit from the demigods will begin to realize that it is really Lord Krsna in the heart of the demigod that awards the benefit. Also, all the demigods are present in the person of the Spiritual master as Lord Krsna states in Srimad Bhagavatam 11.17.27

acharyamam vijaniyam
nava manyeta carachit
na martya budyasuyat
sarva deva maya guro

"One should know the acarya as Myself, and never disrespect Him at any time. One should not envy Him, thinking Him an ordinary man for in him are represented all the demigods."

Other helpful verses are Srimad Bhagavatam 2.3.10 "akama sarva kamo va.." and 4.31.14 "yatha tarora mula nisecanena..."

Regarding Lord Shiva, Srila Sridhar Maharaj stated that His position is unique in that he exists simultaneously on both sides of Viraja. On this side as Devotee always meditating on Sankarshan Visnu yet with family of Parvati, Ganesha & Kartikeya, He acts as a controller of this world. In Vaikuntha as Sada-shiv He has his own vaikuntha planet and is simultaneously one and different with Visnu. In Goloka He is manifest as Gopishwar Shiv, protecting the rasa-dance of the Lord and also has the power to give entrance there. So there appear to be three levels of His revelation. The Bramha-samhita states that he is non different from the Lord as milk and curd are similar. He is unique, mysterious and unlimited. As per the Upanishads...The mysteries of transcendental truth can only be truly understood by revelation...yam evesya vrnuti tena labyas...by those whom the Lord Himself chooses.

The following is some information regrading Lord Shiva that I've gathered from the internet.

Sri Vraja-dhama-mahimamrita

The Nectarean Glories of Vraja-dhama

(6)jaya jaya gopiswara vrindavana-maj jaya jaya krishna-sakha batu dwija-raj

(6) All glories, all glories to Gopisvara Siva, who resides in Vrindavana in order to protect the holy dhama. All glories, all glories to Krishna's funny brahmana friend, Madhumangala.

Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.5.33

dhyeyam- sada paribhavaghnam abhista-doham
tirthaspadam siva-virinci-nutam saranyam
bhrityarti-ham pranata-pala bhavabdhi-potam
vande maha-purusa te caranaravindam

"We offer our respectful obeisances unto the lotus feet of Him, the Lord, upon whom we should always meditate. He destroys insults to His devotees. He removes the distresses of His devotees and satisfies their desires. He, the abode of all holy places and the shelter of all sages, is worshipable by Lord Siva and Lord Brahma. He is the boat of the demigods for cro! ssing the ocean of birth and death.

Srimad-Bhagavatam 12.13.16

(Suta Gosvami instructs the sages of Naimisaranya)

nimna-ganam yatha ganga
devanam acyuto yatha
vaisnavanam yatha sambhuh
purananam idam tatha

Just as the Ganga is the greatest of all rivers, Lord Acyuta the supreme among deities and Lord Sambhu [Siva] the greatest of Vaisnavas, so Srimad-Bhagavatam is the greatest of all Puranas.

Srimad-Bhagavatam 6.3.20

svayambhur naradah sambhuh
kumarah kapilo manuh
prahlado janako bhismo
balir vaiyasakir vayam

Lord Brahma, Bhagavan Narada, Lord Siva, the four Kumaras, Lord Kapila [the son of Devahuti], Svayambhuva Manu, Prahlada Maharaja, Janaka Maharaja, Grandfather Bhisma, Bali Maharaja, Sukadeva Gosvami and I myself(Yamaraj) know the real religious principle.

Bhagavad Gita 10.8 Purport by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupad

Narayana Upanisad

[.....] narayanad brahma jayate, narayanad prajapatih prajayate, narayanad indro jayate, narayanad astau vasavo jayante, narayanad ekadasa rudra jayante, narayanad dvadasadityah: "From Narayana, Brahma is born, and from Narayana the patriarchs are also born. From Narayana, Indra is born, from Narayana the eight Vasus are born, from Narayana the eleven Rudras are born, from Narayana the twelve Adityas are born." This Narayana is an expansion of Kri! shna.[.....]

eko vai narayana asin na brahma na isano napo nagni-samau neme dyav-aprithivi na naksatrani na suryah: "In the beginning of the creation there was only the Supreme Personality Narayana. There was no Brahma, no Siva, no water, no fire, no moon, no stars in the sky, no sun." (Maha Upanisad 1) In the Maha Upanisad it is also said that Lord Siva was born from the forehead of the Supreme Lord. Thus the Vedas say that it is the Supreme Lord, the creator of Brahma and Siva, who is to be worshiped.

In the Moksa-dharma Krishna also says,

prajapatim ca rudram capy
aham eva srijami vai
tau hi mam na vijanito
mama maya-vimohitau

"The patriarchs, Siva and others are created by Me, though they do not know that they are created by Me because they are deluded by My illusory energy." In the Varaha Purana it is also said, narayanah paro devas
tasmaj jatas caturmukhah
tasmad rudro 'bhavad devah
sa ca sarva-jnatam gatah

"Narayana is the Supreme! Personality of Godhead, and from Him Brahma was born, from whom Siva was born."[.....]

Sri Brahma-samhita 5.15

vamangad asrijad visnum daskinangat prajapatim
jyotir-lingamayam sambhum kurca-desad avasrijat

Maha Visnu created Visnu from His left side, Prajapati from His right side, and He created Sambhu(Siva), the divine manifested masculine effulgence, from between His Eyebrows.

Purport: by Srila Bhaktivinod Thakur

[.....]The Divine manifested masculine effuglence form of Sambhu(Shiva) is the plenary manifestation of his origin, the original primal male generative Sambhu(Shiva).[.....]

At the end of the Nrisimha-tapani Upanisad it is said:

"One brahmana is equal to a hundred non-brahmanas. One brahmana householder is equal to a hundred other brahmanas. One vanaprastha is equal to a hundred householders. One sannyasi is equal to a hundred v! anaprasthas. One chanter of Siva-mantras is equal to a hundred sannyasis. One teacher of the Atharvangirasa-sakha is equal to a hundred chanters of Siva-mantras. One teacher of the regal Nrisimha-mantra is equal to a hundred teachers of the Atharvangirasa-sakha. A teacher of the regal Nrisimha-mantra goes to a realm where there are no sufferings, where the sun does not shine, where the wind does not blow, where the moon and the stars do not shine, where fire does not burn, where death cannot enter, where there are no faults, where there is eternal bliss, eternal, peace, and eternal auspiciousness, a place worshiped by Brahma and the demigods, a place meditated on by the yogis, a place where the yogi go and never return, a place glorified in the Rig Veda with the words:[....]

In the Brihat-sahasra-nama-stotra, Lord Siva affirms:

navaisnavaya datavyam
vikalpopahatatmane
bhakti-sraddha-vihinaya
visnu-samanya-darsine

"These thousand names should not be given to one who is not a devotee of Lord Visnu, to one whose heart is destroyed by mental speculation, to one who has no faith in devotional service, or to one who thinks the demigods are equal to Lord Visnu."

na yanti tat-param sreyo
visnum sarvesvaresvaram
sarva-bhavair anasritya
puranam purusottamam

"They who do not wholeheartedly take shelter of Lord Visnu, the master of all the demigods, the ancient Supreme Personality of Godhead, do not attain the most auspicious condition of life.

At the end of those prayers Goddess Durga also affirms:

aho sarvesvaro visnuh
sarva-devottamottamah
jagad-adi-gurur mudhaih
samanya iva viksyate

"Lord Visnu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the master of all the demigods, the first spiritual master of the universe. Only fools think the demigods are His equals."

yam uddisya sada natho
maheso 'pi dig-ambarah
jata-bhasmanuliptangas
tapasvi viksate janaih

"It is to attain Lord Visnu that the demigod Siva performs austerities, his hair matted and his naked body covered with ashes. That is why the people see Lord Siva in that way.

In the Hari-vamsa, Lord Siva says:

"O brahmanas in the mode of pure goodness, please always worship Lord Krishna. Please always chant the mantras of Lord Krishna. Please always meditate on Lord Krishna."

In the Hari-vamsa, Lord Siva says:

"O brahmanas in the mode of pure goodness, please always worship Lord Krishna. Please always chant the mantras of Lord Krishna. Please always meditate on Lord Krishna."

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION

The non antrhropomorphic Lingam form of Shiva is what is held in reverence in temples all over the sub continent. The Lingam is a symbol. It is a symbol of that which is invisible yet omnipresent. It is hence a a visible symbol of the Ultimate Reality which is present in us (and in all objects of creation ).

The Shivalingam denotes the primeval energy of the Creator.It is believed that at the end of all creation, during the great deluge, all of the different aspects of God find a resting place in the Lingam; Bhrama is absorbed into the right, Vishnu to the left and Gayatri into the heart. The Shivalingam is also a representation of the infinite Cosmic Column of fire, whose origins, Vishnu and Bhrama were unable to trace. (see Lingodbhavar).

Legend has it that Parvati fashioned a Shivalingam with a fistful of sand at Kanchipuram and worshipped Shiva; this lingam is known as the Prithvilingam, denoting the primordial element earth. Shivalingams in several temples are swayambus, or that which appeared on their own, or that which is untouched by a chisel. On the other hand, there are temples where the Shivalingam is carved out of stone and installed. The highly polished Shivalingams of the Pallava period bear several stripes, as in the Kailasanatha temple at Kanchipuram.

The Shivalingam is generally mounted on a circular or quadrangular receptacle called the Avudaiyar. This pedestal is designed so as to drain off the water offered during ablution ceremonies. In temples such as Kanchipuram, abhishekam is offered only to the pedestal and not to the Shivalingam made of sand. The bottom of the pedestal represents Bhrama, the octogonal middle represents Vishnu and the upper circular portion represents Shiva. The upper portion of the Shivalingam may be of various shapes, cylindrical, elliptical, umbrella shaped. Images may also be (rarely) carved on a Shivalingam.

Nandi, the bull is depicted facing the sanctum in all Saivite temples, symbolizing the human soul Jeevatma yearning for realizing its oneness with Paramatma, the ultimate reality.

Typically, the processional bronze images of Shiva are those of Somaskanda, Chandrasekhara, Bhikshatana and Nataraja. Although in most Shiva temples, the central shrine enshrining the Shivalingam is of the greatest importance, the Nataraja shrine is of greater importance at Chidambaram, the Somaskandar - Tyagarajar shrine is of greater significance at Tiruvarur.

The common thread of thought in the religious beliefs of the Indian subcontinent upholds a single Reality (as in absolute monoism) and holds in reverence each of the several manifestation of the Ultimate Reality in the forms of Gods. Bhrama, Vishnu and Shiva are revered as the Supreme Trinity of multitude of manifestations of Divinity. It is said that all that is true, all that is good and all that is beautiful is God (Satyam Shivam Sundaram).

Shiva is referred to as 'the good one' or the 'auspicious one'. Shiva - Rudra is considered to be the destroyer of evil and sorrow. Shiva - Shankara is the doer of good. Shiva is 'tri netra' or three eyed, and is 'neela kantha' - blue necked (having consumed poison to save the world from destruction. Shiva - Nataraja is the Divine Cosmic Dancer. Shiva - Ardhanareeswara is both man and woman.

He is both static and dynamic and is both creator and destroyer. He is the oldest and the youngest, he is the eternal youth as well as the infant. He is the source of fertility in all living beings. He has gentle as well as fierce forms. Shiva is the greatest of renouncers as well as the ideal lover. He destroyes evil and protects good. He bestows prosperity on worshipers although he is austere. He is omnipresent and resides in everyone as pure consciousness.

Shiva is inseparable from Shakti - Parvati the daughter of Himavaan - Haimavati. There is no Shiva without Shakti and no Shakti without Shiva, the two are one - or the absolute state of being - consciousness and bliss.

The five mantras that constitute Shiva's body are Sadyojaata, Vaamadeva, Aghora, Tatpurusha and Eesaana. Eesaana is Shiva not visible to the human eye, Sadyojaata is Shiva realized in his basic reality (as in the element earth, in the sense of smell, in the power of procreation and in the mind). The Vishnudharmottara Purana of the 6th century CE assigns a face and an element to each of the above mantras. (Sadyojaata - earth, Vaamadeva - water, Aghora - fire, Tatpurusha - air and Eesaana - space).

The names of the deified faces with their elements are Mahadeva (earth), Bhairava (fire), Nandi (air), Uma (water) and Sadasiva (space). Panchamukha lingams have been seen from the 2nd century onwards. The Trimurthi Sadasiva image of Shiva in the Elephanta Caves near Mumbai is a portrayal in stone, of the five faces of Shiva. The fourth and the fifth heads are not seen in this image here.

The works of sages Vyasa, Vasishta, Patanjali, the poet Kalidasa, the tamil saint poets Nayanmars - Appar, Sundarar, Sambandar, the poet Manikkavachakar, the mystic tamil siddhas, tantric philosophers, the spiritual leader Adi Sankaracharya and others such as Basavanna and Appayya Deekshitar speak of the attributes of Shiva.

Related Articles

Beliefs and Legends >>Shiva

Lingodbhavamurthy is an iconic representation of Shiva, installed in the rear devakoshta (niche) of the garbagriha (sanctum) of all Shiva temples. The story of Lingodbhavar is that of the attempts of Vishnu and Bhrama to discover the origins (the beginning Aadi and the end Antha) of Shiva, as stated in three of the puranas - the Kurma Purana, the Vayu Purana and Shiva Purana.

Vishnu was engaged in his yoganidhra - the slumber of yoga - at the end of a kalpa, in the waters of the great deluge, when there appeared before him, Bhrama emerging from a great illumination. Bhrama introduced himself to Vishnu as the Creator of the Universe, to which Vishnu replied that he was the architect of the Universe. An argument ensued between both as to their superiority over one another, when there appeared before them - a huge lingam of fire - with tongues of flames blazing out of it.

Curious to trace the origins of this column of fire, Bhrama assumed the form of a swan and flew upwards, while Vishnu assumed the form of a boar, and burrowed down into the earth. Days of search in either direction proved futile, and hence the duo surrendered to this column of fire with prayers. Shiva then appeared out of this column of fiery lingam, with a thousand arms and legs, with the sun, moon and fire as his three eyes, bearing the pinaka bow, wearing the hide of an leephant, bearing the trishul, and addressed Vishnu and Bhrama in a thunderous voice, explaining that the two were born out of him, and that the three were then separated out into three different aspects of divinity.

The non-anthropomorphic form Shivalingam is a representation of this infinite cosmic column of fire, whose origins were not tracable by Bhrama or Vishnu. The Shivalingam is the center of reverence and worship in all Saivite temples.

The manifestation of Shiva in this column of fire in front of Bhrama and Vishnu, is carved in stone, as the Lingodbhavamurthy manifestation of Shiva, and is always enshrined in the rear niche of the sanctum enshring a Shivalingam. Since most temples face east, Lingodbhavar faces West.

This legend described above is held at the vast Arunachaleswara temple complex at Tiruvannamalai, where the sacred Annamalai hill itself, is considered to be a manifestation of this cosmic column of fire. Tiruvannamalai, is one of the Pancha Bhoota Stalas, representing the primordial element fire.

There is another interesting aspect to this legend. While Bhrama was flying upwards in the guise of a swan, he saw the petals of a ketaki flower drifting down. Tired by the futility of his efforts to reach the top of the mysterious column of fire, Bhrama requested the flower to acquiese to his lie that he had seen the top of the column where the flower had previously resided. Accompanied by his accomplice, Bhrama confronted Vishnu and asserted that he had indeed discovered the origin of the cosmic column. An enraged Shiva appeared out of the fiery column and cursed Bhrama so that he would not be worshipped in temples on earth. This legend relates to the fact that there are hardly any temples dedicated to Bhrama in India. There is a shrine to Bhrama at Uttamar Koyil in Tamilnadu, and Bhrama is also represented in the devakoshtas (niches) in Shiva temples; there are thus no Bhrama temples of any significance in India.

AUM SIVA SIVA
Courtesy of http://www.hinduismtoday.kauai.hi.us/ArtAndCulture/Aums/

Shiva has many forms and iconographic images. In some places the deity is worshipped in its male/female form, as Shiva and Shakti. In other forms, Shiva is in the form of the Lord of the Dance, as you have already read about (look at the sight entitled Shiva Nataraja or Dances of Shiva). Another common iconographic image of Shiva is the Linga.

According to the Padmapurana, on a certain occasion, Lord Shiva appeared before Rama of Ayodhya and told him that it was better to worship the Lord in his symbol called Linga than to worship him as an image (Rabindra Kuma Siddhantashtashastree 54). Linga literally means "characteristic mark". A Shiva Linga looks somewhat phallic. It is supposed to represent the idea of the "formless" and the "all formed", which is the nature of Shiva. As there is nothing in the world not pervaded by Shiva, the Linga form has a thousand heads, a thousand eyes, a thousand feet. It has a hand and foot on every side, on every side an eye and an ear. The hemispherical top of the Shiva Linga consists of thousands of heads, each of the size of a point. The sides of the cylindrical feet are his eyes, hands, and faces. The circular bottom represents his feet. Though the image has hundreds of hands, eyes, feet, etc., it really has none of these. Thus, the Shiva Linga is the closest possible approximation to the cosmic Purusa, the everlasting, unchanging consciousness. (Iconography of the Hindus, 38).

Another image of Shiva is a Shiva Linga with five faces or murtis. These are the five faces of Shiva. Sometimes the five faces are thought to represent the four Vedas with the fifth face representing the Puranas or development of Tantra literature. The five faces also can represent the five different activities of Shiva: Creation, Sustenance, Destruction, Concealer, and Revealer (Siddhantashastree, 120-24).

The Tantras and Puranas give another definition of the five murtis. They call them Sadyojata, Vamadeva, Aghora, Tatpurusa, and Isana. They are defined as earth, water, fire, air, and ether respectively. The fifth face is on top of Shiva's head and is called ether because this remains always over the head of the worshippers of Shiva (Siddhantashastree, 121).

Another description of the five faces calls the eastern face, Mahadevamukha. This is the principal of all faces; it contains Shiva's three different eyes, which signify the sun, moon, and fire. The southern face is called Bhairava. This is the fearful, fierce shape of Shiva. the Western face is Nandivaktra, and holds a pleasing, sublime countenance. The northern face, UmaVaktra is called the face of motherly tenderness. Finally the fifth face, facing upwards, is called Sadsiva. Literally, this means ever-benignant--very sacred. (123-24). For Saivite worshippers, the five faces also represent the five stages of Shiva worship and the five ages or Yugas.
Shiva icons often carry some of the same symbols, no matter what temple they are in or where they are made. These very common iconographic symbols include:

Third eye
this eye rests between Shiva's eyebrows, and represents both the moon, as well as Shiva's sovereign power.

Snake wrapped around Shiva's chest
the represents anger--It is with this that Shiva controls the three worlds. The snake can also represent the Kundalini power that resides within everyone at the base of their spine and within their subtle body.(126)

Tiger's Hide
This is often pictured around Shiva's waist, and represents greed, which is always subjugated by Shiva and his divine grace.

Ox
This is the mount of Lord Shiva, and represents Dharma, or Piety, without which Shiva would not be pleased.

It is important to realize that the deity Shiva has no true visible form. S/he is the formless immeasurable. According to the Tantra, which utilizes iconographic images of Shiva within forms of meditation, images are created for the purpose of helping devotees concentrate their minds for the proper realization of the characteristics of Shiva, not for the identification of the deity him/herself. (117)

While, the non-anthropomorphic Lingam form of Shiva, is primarily held in worship in all Saivite temples, the iconic forms or archa murthys of Shiva have been carved in stone (in the devakosthas or niches - and in temple towers and panels), and frozen in metal and held in worship for centuries together.

The earliest examples of these carvings are from the Elephanta and the Ellora caves in Maharashtra of the Gupta period, Badami, Aihole in Andhra Pradesh and Karnataka, Mahabalipuram and other Pallava sites in Tamilnadu, Chamba and Bhramour in North India.

The best specimen of these images are seen from the Chola period of the earlier portion of the 2nd millennium CE. Also to be mentioned are the fine bronzes which also date back to the same period.

The commonly seen iconic representations of Shiva are Nataraja, Somaskanda, Chandrasekhara, Bhikshatana, Dakshinamurthy, Lingodbhava, Sukhasanamurthy, Vaivahikamurthy, Uma Maheswara, Rishabharuda, Tripurantaka, Harihara (or the Shiva Vishnu manifestation), Ardhanareeswara (the Shiva-Shakti manifestation), Chandesanugrahamurthy (Shiva blessing Chandikeswara), Kaalasamhaaramurthy and Sadasi

Vamana Purana
When naked Lord Shiva was wandering in the Daruvanam forest, the wives of sages lost self control for Lord Shiva was the most beautiful and attractive man and they at once were seduced by the Lord. The sages who failed to recognize the Lord thought he was an ordinary immortal and cursed him: May the Lingam (penis) of this man fall to the ground! That instant the Lingam of Shiva fell to the ground, and the God immediately disappeared. The Lingam, as it fell, penetrated through the earth to the lower worlds and increased in height until it towered above the heavens. The earth quaked, all things movable and immovable agitated. Brahma and Vishnu then decided to find the ends of the great Lingam, while Vishnu mounted on Garuda descended down and Brahma on his lotus ascended the heavens. They returned to where they started unable to find the ends of the great Lingam, and with great reverence and praise they requested Lord Shiva to resume his Lingam. Lord Shiva thus propitiated appeared and said: If gods and men will worship, I will resume it. To this proposal Brahma and Vishnu and all other Gods agreed and since then the Lingam is worshipped by all.

Shiva Purana
On falling in consequence of the sages' curse, the Lingam became like fire, and caused a conflagration wherever it penetrated; the three worlds were distressed, and as neither Gods nor sages could find rest, they hastened for protection to Brahma. Having heard them relate all that happened, Brahma replied, “After having committed knowingly a reprehensible act, why say that it was done unknowingly? Every one shall reap the fruit of his good or bad actions, and the Lingam therefore shall not cease to distress the worlds until the God resumes it. Propitiate by adoration the mountain-born Goddess, and she will assume the form of Yoni (vagina) and receive the Lingam, by which means only it can be rendered innocuous. After obtaining the consent of Parvati, form a vessel of eight kinds of leaves, place in it boiled rice and sacred plants, having it filled with holy water, consecrate with proper prayers and invocations, and with water repeating at the same time suitable prayers, sprinkle the Lingam. After Parvati receives the Lingam in her Yoni, you erect and consecrate the form of Lingam in the Yoni. By worshipping it with offerings of flowers, perfumes and such things, by kindling lamps before it, and by singing music propitiate Maheswara and he will forgive you.” As per Brahma's instructions, the Gods and sages sought the assistance of Parvati. Parvati received in her Yoni the Lingam and appeased its consuming fire. In commemoration of this event the worship of Lingam was instituted.

Lainga Purana
Brahma said to angels, “When I sprang into existence, I beheld the mighty Narayana reposing on the abyss of waters, and, being under the influence of delusion, awakened him with my hand and addressed him: 'who art thou that thus slumberest on this terrible ocean?' Hari awoke dispelling sleep from his lotus eyes, looked upon me and then arising said, 'Welcome, welcome O Pitamaha, my dear son!' On hearing the first of the Gods speak, I confinedwithin the bonds of the quality of impurity, replied: why dost thou say, my dear son? For know me to be eternal god, the universal spirit, the creator, the preserver and the destroyer of the three worlds.' He immediately answered, “Hear the truth, Oh four faced! And learn that it is I who am the creator, the preserver, and the destroyer, how canst thou forget Narayana the self-existent and eternal Being?' hence arose terrible combat amidst the waters of the deluge, where to appease the contest and recall us to our senses, appeared a Lingam blazing like a thousand suns. Bewildered by its radiant beams, Hari thus said to me lost in amazement, 'I will proceed downwards in order to ascertain the termination of this wondrous column of fire, do thou, O lord, proceed upwards and seek for its top.' Having thus spoken he assumed the form of a boar, and I that of a swan, and we both proceeded in our search for four thousand years, but being unable to ascertain its termination, we then returned back wearied and disappointed. Thus still under influence of delusion, we prostrated ourselves before the Lingam, and were reflecting on what it could be. Then we heard a voice saying Om, Om, Om- and shortly after appeared Shiva in the midst of that column of fire. In commemoration of this event therefore was the worship of Lingam instituted.”

Scanda Purana and Visva-Sara-Prakasha
One day naked Mahadeva with a club in his hand chanced to pass by near a place where several sages were performing their devotions. Mahadeva laughed at them, insulted and provoked them with gestures and signs. The sages cursed him and his Lingam or Phallus fell to the ground. Mahadeva in this state of mutilation traveled over the world bewailing his misfortune and his consort Parvati ran after him singing mournful songs. (In Greek mythology this is called wanderings of Demeter and lamentations of Bacchus) The world thus stopped procreation and came to a standstill. Gods and men searched for the sacred Lingam and found it grown to an immense size. They cut it with hatchets into thirty-one pieces that became perfect Lingams. The Gods left twenty-one on earth and took nine to heaven and removed one to netherworld.

Shaivites insits that Kaba is one of the twenty-one places on earth. Arabian authors opine that Lingas were worshipped all over Arabia. According to many sources the first phallus was erected on the banks of Euphrates and was known as Balef-Wara-Linga.

varadaraja sharma

31-03-06, 02:20 PM

Radhe Krishna,

First of all the classification of God and Demigods itself is self defeating. In any vaidika sampradaya, God is only one. All else are parivara devathas. if u see it from the eyes of christianity or islam, there although they have only one god, they have many many angels, jins etc.,.
In vedic religion, the ultimate truth is god and he is one and only one irrespective of any sampradaya.
be shaiva, vaishnava, saktha, gaanapathya, saura, skanda, advaiti, vishistadvaiti, dvaiti et al.
if u consider Lord shiva as God all else, including Maha Vishnu become his parivara devathas.
same is true with Lord vishnu or Devi Shakthi for that matter.
If u consider, Lord Vishnu as God, all else including Lord Shiva becomes his parivara devathas.
All the 18 puranas are written with basic guidelines of purana lakshana. From shiva purana, lainga purana one can conclude that Lord shiva is the ultimate god and he created the world and all devathas including lord mahavishnu.
From vishnu purana, padma purana, Bhagavatham u can conclude that Lord vishnu created the world and all else including lord shiva are his parivara devathas.
depending on the purana u take as a yardstick for ur interpretation and ur skills of interpretation u can interpret the facts one way or the other.
But for the sake of God realisation, It is a must that Ekagra Bhakthi is very much required to reap the fruits of Bhakthi.
Here one friend said the praise to lord krishna tickles down to other devathas (Demi gods). Vice versa also is true.
"Aakashath pathitham thoyam yatha gachathi sagaram
Sarva deva namaskaraha keshavam prathi gachathi".
like the waters of rivers ultimately reaches the ocean, the obeisance paid to any devatha, ultimately reaches lord keshava.
So much has been quoted from Bhagavath gita. lets see what is there in Bhagavatham.
Gopa Kanyas worship Devi in Brindavanam :

"Katyayani Mahamaye maha yogin yateeshwari
Nanda gopa sutam devi patim me kuru the namaha"

Hey! Katyayani Devi, bless me that i get married to "Gopala".

In Rukmani sandesha, Devi Rukmani requests god to take her when she goes to the temple of their Kuladevi for worship, he should come and take her .

From the above, it can be seen, that such exalted souls have indulged in devathanthara worship.

Yet, yet one should not miss one aspect of their worship.

Although, they prayed the devathantharas, see What was their wish.

It is getting Lord Krishna.

once a person progress in Bhakthi, the devathanthara worship gets melted from krishna bhakthi like ice gets melted from sunshine.

Devathanthara worship is not described as sin per se in classical smrthis but still it affects ekagra bhakthi.

Or I may say one is not getting completely getting involved in bhakthi.

u read Gita, Bhagabvatham, Radha rasa sudhanidhi, hari bhakthi vilasam where would be there time for worshipping devathantharas.

ur mind gets completely submerged in the love of god krishna.

same is the case for those engaged in shaiva or shaktha bhakthi.

ekagratha is the key.

ekagra bhakthi is uttama bhakthi

devathanthara bhakthi per se although is not sin would not help u in getting the tree of bhakthi nourished

devathanthara dvesha or devathanthara ninda is per se a sin which is cursed in all scriptures.

A devathanthara dveshi or a devathanthara nindaka is ultimately a disguised bhaktha of the devatha whom he hates. cause rather than thinking of his lord, he indulges in thinking of the other albeit in a derogatory manner.

There were many asuras in this category. Many shiva bhakthas and many vishnubhakthas rather than indulging in the bhathi of their god indulged in ninda of the other and they were admonished by their lord and redirected towards his bhakthi

Radhe Krishna

rakeshsingh2

07-09-07, 12:28 AM

Most of the Hindus believe that Lord Vishnu is the supreme god, but ISKCOn says that Krishna is the supreme god. Since Bhagwan Krishna is the incarnation of Lord Vishnu so both should be considered same or equal.

But problem with ISKCON they do not have respect to other gods (SHIVA, GANESHA.. ) they do not give much importance to Lord Rama, even he is same as Krishna. We don't find any Lord Rama deity in any of the ISKCON temple, but you will find Nityanand mahaprabhu & other bhakta being worshiped in almost all the ISKCON. I have high respect (sraddha) to Chaitanya mahaprabhu & Nityanand mahaprabhu. One thing I can't believe that ISKCON treats Chaitanya mahaprabhu & Nityanand mahaprabhu higher than Ram & other god that's the reason they worship their line of gurus but not Lord RAM.

We will hardly find any ISKCON devotee reading Ramayana, for a ISKCON devotee Chaitanya Charitamrit is the highest scripture.