Self appointed and Voted in Gurus - Unauthorized!

There was no mundane decision by Srila Prabhupada to become guru.
Srila Prabhupada was empowered by Lord Krishna to awaken God
consciousness in the hearts of so many human beings that He could
not avoid His position, as a pure devotee – servant of the Lord.

Srila Prabhupada never claimed Himself to be guru. Rather, He
often said that He was only doing this to please His spiritual
master, His Divine Grace Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura and Lord
Krishna.

Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura requested of Srila Prabhupada to
go to the English-speaking countries and spread Krishna
Consciousness. This pastime had also been predicted at Srila
Prabhupada's birth by his astrologer who said that when Prabhupada
turned seventy, He would become a great religious leader and travel
across the ocean to open 108 temples.

Due to Srila Prabhupada's empowerment by the Lord, he was able to
fulfill the prophecy of the astrologer and also His spiritual
master's desire to spread Krishna Consciousness world wide.

Being capable of wakening so many fallen souls and softening their
hearts to love of the Supreme Lord is certainly a pastime of self-
effulgent guru as opposed to someone who wakes up one morning and
decides, "Today I shall be guru."

People will naturally flock to and offer full respects to a self-
effulgent guru whereas a self-appointed guru must convince and/or
coerce others to "worship" him.

As for the voting in of guru – there was no votes by anyone for
Prabhupada to be guru. This is not a part of our tradition and is a
concoction perpetrated by the bogus gurus of today's ISKCON.

How can votes turn someone into a pure devotee? Stopping this
concoction and putting Srila Prabhupada back at the center of His
movement is the only answer to save ISKCON from completely
disintegrating.

Srila Prabhupada condemns the voting in of Gurus:

"Mundane votes have no jurisdiction to elect a Vaisnava acarya. A
Vaisnava acarya is self-effulgent, and there is no need for any
court judgment. A false acarya may try to override a Vaisnava by a
high-court decision, but Bhaktivnoda Thakura says that he is nothing
but a disciple of Kali-yuga."
(Cc Madhya 1:220, purport)

My Dear Friend Rukmini,

Please accept my humble obeisances at your feet.

All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Please forgive me my offenses to you, a good devotee of Lord Krsna.

This message you have posted is most beneficial for everyone to read, and acceptance of similar surrender to Srila Prabhupada as yours would save even the most vile of souls, such as myself.

How could any sincere devotee dismiss Srila Prabhupada's own words on this topic of elections in relation the Vaisnavas?

Although I have none of the qualities of a real devotee of the Lord - and thus suspect my prayers should go unheard - I shall pray for every devotee who has been, is being, or may be bewildred by the transcendentally offensive system of guru-by-election presently poisoning what's left of ISKCON.

I remain
Your servant,
Krsnadasa dasa

Sounds like it has become a mockery to any decent human being. And I see it is reaping its just rewards. Sensible souls with real intelligence have already seen the light and departed elsewhere for the truth. I think people setting themselves up for a cushy life may find falling off the seat a little bit hard! And that time wont be long in coming...

[tirthadas]

Prabhus...devil's advocate here.

Is the current initiating-guru system in ISKCON really and truly in place to protect the interests of a cadre of self-promoters, or is it the result of an honest attempt at self-policing after the disasters of the past?

Hypothetical situation: Bhakta Joe approaches Maharaja Swami and asks him for initiation, having associated with, served under, and heard Krishna-katha from said Maharaja for an appropriate period of time. Bhakta J is a sincere person who has learned the basics of Krishna Consciousness well, made solid advancement, and is qualified to recognize a person with the qualities of a sadhu and to become the disciple of a sadhu; Maharaja has a spotless 30-year record, has never initiated a disciple, and has done all of his service within ISKCON as a faithful follower of Srila Prabhupada. He has no wish to leave ISKCON and considers himself a humble servant and unqualified to be a guru, but sees Bhakta J's sincere transcendental attachment to him and realizes the time and circumstances are right to make this step for the spiritual well-being of a sincere aspiring Vaisnava.

However, the past being what it is, and not wishing to see it repeated, the GBC has put into effect a number of qualifications which a prospective guru in a situation like this must meet before being allowed to initiate disciples within the auspices of ISKCON.

Maharaja Swami therefore has these choices:

-Tell Bhakta Joe that he will gladly initiate him after he (Maharaja) has openly submitted himself to the qualification process established by the GBC and has been approved to initiate disciples within ISKCON. In the meantime, Maharaja will keep Bhakta J close and continue to give him shelter and siksha.

-Tell Bhakta Joe that the GBC is nothing but a rubber-stamping board of corrupt cronies and, since other prospective disciples have approached him as well, they will all leave ISKCON and set up their own "pure" spiritual society.

-Advise Bhakta Joe to leave ISKCON and seek out a ritvik priest who will ostensibly initiate him as a disciple of Srila Prabhupada.

-Advise Bhakta Joe to stay in ISKCON but for initiation, go to so-and-so Swami, who already has hundreds of disciples, and who Bhakta J knows about as well as he knows George Bush. So-and-so Swami may be an "entrenched representative" of a past system that did not work, as well.

All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.

[Pankaja dasa]

____
We hope, therefore, that people will derive the greatest benefit by studying Bhagavad-gita As It Is as we have presented it here, and if even one man becomes a pure devotee of the Lord we shall consider our attempt a success.
Bg.Preface

I am not an expert in this, neither can I say otherwise. Krishna says out of trillions of people hardly one knows Him in Truth. Why is that? You may ask!?

I tell you why. Because it takes many many births. I supect the devotees right now are Madhyama-adikaris devotees. Who CAN fall at any time. But they are trying FOR Prabhupada. And it actually says they can. But it also says we need an Uttama-adikari devotee as Guru. WHY? I tell you why! Because only if you WORSHIP a PURE devotee is Krsna actually pleased. Krishna devotees are in Krishna heart. Though please don't reject what SP says in that BG.Intro. :roll:

NB: Madhyama devotees are rare as well.

[varadaraja sharma]

Radhe Krishna
m not a member of ISKCON. can any member of ISKCON explain me whether the gurus in ISKCON are initiated by way of voting. It is surprising to learn this fact.

with regards
Radhe Krishna

Varadaraja Sharma

[judas]

i have been trying for many years to follow the teachings of Srila Prabhupada, having accepted HDG as my Siksha guru, i am not a member of ISKCON. i have been initiated by another pure devotee also(whose divine holy name i will not reveal HERE) the fighting of the "ritvik"-GBC is keeping some busy while others are busy trying to spread Krsna consciousness to the suffering masses..what happened to "if you love me you will co-operate" don't see too much of it, do we ?
judas

[judas]

Actually..HDG Srila Prabhupadaji, IS, and ALWAYS WILL BE, "SRI GURU"...HDG SRILA PRABHUPADA IS BY HIS VERY STATE OF CONSCIOUSNESS, his relationship with with Their Lordships,and all living entities..ie.."your ever wellwisher"
HDG always cosidered himself lower than the straw in the street,more humble than a blade of grass...etc ad infinitum. and even if ever it appeared to mundane eyes that HDG behaved contrary to these principles, it is FOR SURE that Srila Prabhupada never tried to control the enviroment for his own selfish interest, rather HDG NEVER forgot The Holy Feet of Sri SRI Guru & Gauranga.
He had NO DESIRE for isms and skisms, and he said "if you love me, you will co-operate" .

Guru means ..one who possesses the mood of service to Sri Guru & Gauranga.

Rajnish had loads of "disciples, but is he Guru ?

i apologise 2 y'all 4 me lack of intelligence, and ability, and humilty, but i'm just trying 2 say , what Sri Rukmini dd has said much more beautifully and coherently.

JAYA Srila AC Swami Prabhupada Bhativedanta

IN the Sri Chaitanya Saraswata Math, we pray every day the following prayer by Sri Gurudeva.........

Srila Prabhupada Pranam Mantra

nama om visnupadaya krsna-presthaya bhutale
svami sri bhaktivedanta prabhupadaya te nama
gurvajnam sirasi-dharyam saktyavesa sva-rupine
hare-krsneti mantrena pascatya-pracya-tarine
visvacarya prabaryaya divya karunya murtaye
sri bhagavata-madhurya-gita-jnana-pradayine
gaura-sri-rupa-siddhanta-sarasvati nisevine
radha-krsna-padambhoja-bhrngaya gurave nama

"I offer my humble obeisances unto His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, who is very dear to Lord Krsna on this Earth, having taken shelter at His lotus feet. Taking the order of his guru on his head, he became empowered by Nityananda Prabhu to act as a saktyavesa avatara. He distributed the Hare Krsna mantra all over the Eastern and Western world, delivering and uplifting all fallen souls. He is the best of millions of jagat-gurus,because he is the personification of divine mercy. He has distributed the sweet nectar of Srimad-Bhagavatam and the transcendental knowledge of Bhagavad-gita all over the world. He is constantly engaged in exclusive devotional service to Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur, Srila Rupa Gosvami, and Sri Gauranga Mahaprabhu. I offer my humble obeisances unto Srila Prabhupada, who is like a bumblebee always tasting the nectar of the lotus feet of Sri Sri Radha and Govinda."

(Composed by Swami B.S. Govinda Maharaja)


Hare Krsna merciful Vaisnavas,

Jaya HDG Srila AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaja Prabhupadji

Jaya HDG Srila BS Govindadeva Goswami Maharaja

Jaya HDG Srila BR Shridhardeva Goswami Maharaja

Our Beloved Trinity of GURUS, who taught us to let the canines howl at the caravan, as we pass, and to pay them no heed.

AND.. who have given us the opportunitiy to serve them and thus avoid being cheated by so-called "Gurus", who dont want to serve , but to control, and dominate others..... CHEATERS !

Luckily ..we have the Guardianship of...TEACHERS !

Dandavats !