Lord Krishna Forum - Krishna Talk

varadaraja sharma · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 53

Radhe Krishna,

Ilovekrishna, Radhe Krishna,

First of all let me be frank, to ever name devathas as demigods, itself is degradation of God. Whether one is a vaishnava, Shaiva, Shaktha, Even monist who believes in formless Brahmum, as per different interpretations of shasthras, God is one. Devathas are only a species higher than that of human beings who have the capacity to grant boons and punish human beings.
A vaidika, (I dont know whether u r one) - irrespective of the fact whether he is a vaishnava, shaiva, shaktha or a monist can never never get rid of worship of devathas. More than 50% of sukthas in vedas pay obeisannce to different devathas.
But as a way of reciting vedas or performing any rituals as prescribed by scriptures, u r worshipping devathas, what u r doing is just implementing the orders of Lord, the God, Who is one and hailed by me and u as Lord Krishna. He clearly says that shruthi smruthir mamaivagya.
But for fulfilling ur materials wishes if u worship devathas, then ur shraddha on lord is not upto the mark which needs to be corrected. But the fact the u r atleast knowledgeable that ur shraddha is not upto the mark itself is a boon given to u by lord
thanks for ur reply mail
rahde Krishna

varadaraja sharma · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 53

Radhe Krishna,

I dont know if i have conveyed what i intended wrongly. What I meant was - whether u worship lord krishna or lord shiva or shakthi - there should be ekagratha. A baktha should always maintain ekagratha. This applies to krishna baktha also.

I told u in the last reply about vaidikas. A person who recite vedas - if he recite vedas completely - he would be paying obeisance to all devathas - through the sookthas he would be reciting in the vedas - if u say namaha shivaya - it undoubtedly means u r paying obeisance to lord shiva - and if a vaishnava recites vedas - he should be paying obeisance to lord shiva - may be for a thousand odd times.

This can be interpretted in two ways.

the vedaas are the breath of lord vishnu - as u would find in Vamana -thrivikrama avathar - in shrimad bhagavatham. As such reciting vedas is a scriptural order of lord and u r simply following it. (In south India, the Shrivaishnavas - Who are very orthodox and strict vaishnavas as well as Madhvas who are also very strict vaisnavas - who recite vedas can not escape from this) But this does not mean u are worshippping devathanthara. U r only following lord's instructions.

Another interpretation :
Aakashath pathi tham thoyam yatha gachathi saagaram
sarva deva namaskaraha keshavam prathi gachathi

like waters of rivers ultimately reaches sea, obeisance u pay to andy devatha ultimately reaches lord keshava. This is very clearly explained in scriptures.

But only a person whose shraddha is less would indulge in devathanthara worship for his material benefits.

Gopis of Brindavan are considered to be the top most of krishna Bhakthas. I have even heard the position of gopis in Kripalujis lecutures.

If u recite Bhagavatham u should have come across in dashama skanda :

"Kathyayani mahamaye mahayogin yatheeswari
nandagopa sutam devi patim me kuruthe namaha"

means gopis are worshipping "Kathyayani devi" to bless them so that they get "Gopala" as their husband.

To conclude what I clearly mean - the more u engage urself in krishna bakthi - u would not even find time to even think of devathantharas.
But even to have knowledge that u indulge in devathanthara bhakthi and it is against ekagratha - is a boon. it is a boon given by lord to us - to reinstate us in the wholehearted bhakthi of lord.

Radhe krishna

varadaraja sharma · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 53

Radhe Krishna,

As u should be aware, Ilovekrishna, I am neither a member of ISKCON nor a member of Kripaluji Satsangha. I belong to south India. Am a smartha.

My way of worshipping krishna is to recite Shrimad Bhagavatham in a cycle of two Ekadashis. I am also writing the Moolam of Shrimad Bhagavatham. The obsession ISKCON people have with Bhagavath Geeta, that too a specific commentary on Bhagavath geeta, penned by Shri ACB, I like it , appreciate it, admire it and try to inculcate it in my own way. To the extent these people are invlolved in Bhagavath Geeta, if not more, atleast I can say as much, I am involved in Shrimad Bhagavatham. It is everything for me. Ofcourse, in this forum, I have not got a soul who can share his experience of reading all the 18000 shlokas of Shrimad Bhagavatham repeatedly and how he enjoy it and experience it.

Once I told my guru, I am alone at a far off place but I try to recite Bhagavatham regularly. He immediately told me back. dont think like that. when u read Bhagavatham, u read like, shuka uvacha, Bhagawan uvacha, Gopya Oochuhu - it is not like i tell u that u should feel like that u r among them. But it is actually u r with them when u read it.

Yes I have read the whole Bhagavatham many number of times and every time I complete, my interest increase, and I get different experiences every time I recite it. I can not explain it. Since I find and honesty and politeness in ur expressions - and most of all - different from many others - u do not try to find fault with people who are engaged in krishna bhakthi - in a different school, i m sharing this much.

I feel even the urge to share would reduce if I study Bhagavatham more vigorously and more and more.

U have quoted the granthas composed by shri kripaluji. U or any of ur saha krishna bhaktha who have gone through both those granthas and Bhagavatham can share their enjoyment and similarities they found in those granthas.

A grantha composed by a mahapurush is supposed to be repetitively recited by his sishyas. That is the way u pay back the mercy showered upon by ur guru. I dont know as to how many of the granthas u have listed - u have gone through. Even if u have missed a few dohas in any of those, my dear friend, u should go through it immediately.

My guru has composed about 100000 shlokas in samskrutha basha on Radha krishna bhakthi, on the life and times of vishnu bhakthas who lived from aasethu himachalam in every form of sanskrit literature ranging from purana, nataka, kavya in every form of samskrutha poetry and has composed a few thousand keerthanas in samskrutha basha on Radha Krishna yugalam and vishnu bhakthi. Although I have not read each one of them, I can humbly say that I have gone through a major portion of them.

As he taught,

Aacharyeshvapi sarveshu taratamyam vina kalau
Shudham Bhagavatham dharmam jagraha

I have gone through works on Radha krishna bhakthi composed by other sampradaya acharyas too (in samskrutha basha) like Geetha Govinda of Jayadeva, Radha Rasa Sudanidhi (Which we feel to be composed by Hitaharivamsa and ISKCONites dispute and feel to be composed by prabodananda) Hair Bhakthi Vilasam composed by Sanatana Goswami .

Just because I go through compositions compiled by other sampradaya acharyas, I never felt my involvement in my own sampradaya ever diluted. Rather it gets strengthened.

When ever I read these compositions - I never never conceive the philosophy. I single mindedly - I should say this is the blessing of my guru and Radha krishna yugala - go through the exposition of Radha krishna Bhakthi.

In difficult times u confessed that u worshipped devathantharas. In my case, whenever I was in difficulty, naturally my mind prays only to my guru. I dont even pray to krishna.

U know what Prahlada says in Prahlada sthuthi

A person who worships god in expectation of getting some boon as a merchant.

He says "Sa vai vanik"

It is a different thing that in Kunthi stuthi, Kunthi says

"Vipataha santhu naha saswath tatra tatra Jagadguro
Bavatho darshanam yatsyath apunarbhava darshanam"

meaning god give me as many difficulties as possible since whenever I get any difficulties I could not but remember u.

Since remembering u is a sweet experience, if getting difficulties is an opportunity to remember u, give me difficulties.

Radhe Krishna

varadaraja sharma · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 53

Radhe Krishna,

Dear friend, one of the most important thing I wanted to convey in my last post was to know whether u have gone through all the works of kripaluji. Since I understand ( thats my perception) that u r his sishya - I feel very stronly feel - that u should go through each and every one of his composition.

Radhe Krishna

varadaraja sharma · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 53

Radhe Krishna,

and do u recite Shrimad Bhagavatham

Radhe Krishna